Looking Back, Building Forward: Kicking Off 2025 with Lisa Washington and Tom Foley

In this first episode of 2025, host Erin Looney kicks off the year with an inspiring conversation featuring DBIA’s Executive Director/CEO, Lisa Washington, CAE, and Thomas J. Foley, P.E., CCM, DBIA, Commissioner of NYC’s Department of Design and Construction and DBIA’s new National Board Chair. Together, they reflect on the game-changing wins of 2024, explore the ambitious 2025-2027 Strategic Goals and discuss the continued growth of design-build. Plus, Erin introduces exciting new podcast features, including the option to text the show and (maybe) a shift away from her infamous bad jokes. Get the dirt on what’s next for DBIA and the design-build industry.

Guests:
Lisa Washington, CAE
ED/CEO, DBIA

Thomas J. Foley, P.E., CCM, DBIA
Commissioner, NYC Department of Design and Construction

Access all our free design-build resources and learn more about Design-Build Done Right® at dbia.org.

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Chapters

• 0:08 Introduction and Show Updates
• 2:20 Big Wins of 2024
• 4:58 Strategic Goals for 2025-2027
• 8:35 Collaboration and Raising Standards
• 13:27 Reinventing Learning at DBIA
• 17:30 Reimagining Membership
• 23:20 Underutilized Business Enterprise (UBE) Engagement
• 33:48 The Role of Committees
• 37:19 FMI Research Insights
• 40:24 Closing Remarks and Reflections

Transcript

Erin Looney  00:08

In the December episode, I promised some new things were on the horizon for the design build delivers podcast, but I didn't even tell you what they were. So let me do that now. First, you can now text the show if you have comments, questions or just something to share, hit the link at the top of this or any episode description. We'd love to hear your thoughts and maybe even feature them in a future episode. Second, we are sadly retiring my terrible jokes in place of fun facts. Though, did you know the world's tallest building, the Burj Khalifa officially opened January 4. 2010 Nothing says New Beginnings like redefining a skyline. Finally, we're keeping the bonus content episodes to bring you the good stuff that didn't make the first cut, as well as occasional highlights of some of the cool things we're doing here at DBIA. And with that, it's on to 2025 Happy New Year, and welcome to the first design build. Delivers podcast of the year, brought to you by us, CAD and our cons company. I am still your host, Aaron Looney, but I'm starting off the year from Winter Park Florida, a place where the sun is way closer than I remember it being. I hope you are somewhere nice to start the year too. But before we leave 2024 in the past, I talked to DBIA Executive Director and CEO Lisa Washington and Tom Foley, commissioner of New York City's Department of Design and Construction. DBIA is brand new national board chair and kind of unofficially my co host. Lately. We started the conversation with the big wins of the past 365 days. Then I asked them all about what to expect for the next 12 months and beyond, including insights into the 2025 to 2027 strategic goals, new data on the growth of design build and a whole lot more. Now, I know I said this last December, Lisa, when you were on for the same recap and forward look. But this has been a big year at DBIA. I'm starting to think all our years are big, but that is a whole other episode altogether. So let's start today by looking back on 2024 what is one standout win for each of you, and why is it so significant for DBIA and the industry?

Lisa Washington  02:20

Well, I have to tell you, Aaron, the successful update of our core curriculum and certification exam to align with the Recently Updated universal best practices was really the highlight of the year for me. Design, build done right is the heart of what DBIA is all about, and the process itself required such deep collaboration across the entire industry, and those best practices in this new curriculum and exam are not just focused on practices that drive exceptional project outcomes. They're all about ensuring full team success. So you know, this was the first comprehensive update in 10 years, and this opportunity to truly assess how the industry has evolved in that time frame, and to capture that evolution as part of our updated curriculum was just really exciting, and I think it help us take the industry to the next level.

Tom Foley  03:15

Looking back in the past year, our design build program, our pilot program. We've had this tool for a couple of years now, three to four years, but we're really seeing amazing results, literally boots on the ground, for what this new delivery method, what it allows us, and how it allows us to achieve our goals. We have $15 billion borough based jails program, and within the course of the last year, three of our four sites have been dismantled, and we use design build for that. And that's not something that I had thought originally that this was going to be a great benefit of using design build for a demo or a dismantle project out here we had three existing facilities, and within the year, we're seeing the benefits of that to change landscape, as our vendors had requested. And so we went out, and the team has done an amazing, amazing job with the industry, with the partnership with this new contract, and allowed us to literally to clear the slate in a dense urban environment in New York, this past year, we're seeing amazing results at Orchard Beach, Shirley, Chisholm, our pilot program that's being managed by Evie McEvoy, and it's really transcending what's possible. We always knew that was going to be the case. I always have the amazing faith in our team and amazing resources at national DBIA and the Lisa's leadership, but it's really when you're seeing communities transform with brand new recreational facilities that historically would have still been on the drawing board, and here they are being built out. You know, we're doing topping ceremonies on each and every project, and it really is transforming the area, and it's transforming our view of what's possible in New York City, and having amazing partners at the team with us.

Erin Looney  04:58

So it's interesting what you say about. Using design build for a demo, tearing down something that is not serving the purpose it needs to serve anymore is just as important. So thank you for sharing that and maybe putting it into a little bit different perspective. Now that we've reflected on 2024 let's let's look ahead to what I am sure will be another big year. There's a new set of strategic goals for 25 to 2027 so let's talk about them a little bit. There are four different things that we're going to focus on, shaping the future of collaboration, raising the bar and setting the standard, reinventing learning and re imagining membership. How will DBIA is new strategic goals guide efforts for innovation and in supporting the industry broadly,

Lisa Washington  05:40

in lots of ways, but I think that across all four of the goals, there is one ultimate goal for DBIA, and it may seem tucked under reimagining membership, but it applies to everything, and that is removing barriers to Access for DBIA, we are a membership organization, and membership is important, but membership is just about people with a common interest. Right? Our heart, our core is the institute, part of our name, the education, the how to of design, build. So our goal is to remove barriers to access so that we can engage as many people as possible that are either interested in design build or want to know more about design build, because they might be later, because design build is a very distinct set of practices that must be well understood. It is so much more than just a single source contract, and if we don't have more people engaged that understand this will have lots of people engaging in design build done wrong and not design build done right. The underlying goal across all four buckets is to remove those barriers to access, to expand our reach, and to truly educate on the power of design build done right?

Tom Foley  07:00

I totally agree, Lisa, it's so important to as a public owner, of getting the word out, of sharing lessons learned, best practices, to open that conduit. We need more partners at the table with us, regardless of the delivery model, more opportunities for others, for those that have never worked for in my case, for the city of New York, it's so important to bring that in because of what that means. That means that we're going to have more people that are going to be working, more opportunities across the board, different viewpoints for what design should look like, or means and methods in the construction world really drive that innovation. And so you always have to be looking over our shoulder to bring more people to the table. And that's where, as Lisa said, that's where DBIA is key to allow that innovation, allow that growth to really expand on our educational opportunities. And now I'm at the stage where we're demanding that our industry partners are up to the latest with regards to the training, with accreditation, the certification, and, you know, an educated consumer, right? That's what we're looking for. We're looking for those designers, those builders, to come and partner with us, sharing the risk, following all of the best practices, and so getting the word out about who we are, what we do, both as an organization, as far as the city of New York, in my personal world, but nationally, through DBIA, there's so much that I'm learning through the board for our members that are out, you know, West Coast sound South what have you that have done this a number of years, but it's so important for us in New York City, in the tri state area, to learn from that and to continue to build on those best

Erin Looney  08:35

practices. Lisa, you referred to the goals as buckets, which I really like. We're going to look at those first two buckets. They focus on collaboration and raising standards. Now talk about what that looks like. How does DBIA intend to expand our influence and strengthen some of those partnerships? You've both mentioned within the industry over the next three years, we

Lisa Washington  08:56

are well aware that there are many other industry associations out there, and in many regards, DBIA members have chosen DBIA as almost a secondary organization, right? Their primary organization is going to be that organization that represents the discipline, the profession that they've chosen, whether it's the American Institute of Architects, the Associated General Contractors, the American Council of Engineering Companies. So I think it's important that we understand that. First of all, I think it's important for these other organizations to understand that DBIA has a senior focus. Our sole purpose is to advance design, build done right for the good of the industry, for the good of our nation, to enhance capital project delivery. So we're going to continue to do what we've always been doing. You know, collaboration is not just the heart of design build. It's the heart of what DBIA has done. Just as we went out to industry to update our best practices, we will continue to go out to industry as we update and develop new resources and tools, because the. Beauty of DBIA is that we bring in all these diverse perspectives, as Tom mentioned, the diversity and those diverse perspectives drive innovation, and it drives tools and resources that truly ensure success for the entire team, which is also an important goal of DBIA. So we're going to keep reaching out to industry. We're going to keep appreciating their perspectives and views, and we're going to keep being that little hourglass where we're collecting all of this information in that top bucket. It's going to funnel through that little thin, fragile part and come out of the bottom as this collaborative effort that has taken into account all of these perspectives. And I think that if we continue to value perspectives and continue to understand that it is not an either or in terms of whether or not our members are engaged in DBIA or another Association. It's and we teach that in design build the power of and you should belong to them and you should be engaged in DBIA, because design build is the future of project delivery.

Tom Foley  11:01

As always, I totally agree with Lisa. There's, as Lisa had indicated, many associations throughout the country well respected, and we'll continue to collaborate with them. This is something that we've been doing personally within the New York City Market. We're meeting on a monthly basis with AIA ACC I try to keep my acronyms to a minimum, but general contractor Association, American Society of Civil Engineers, and we've already engaged with them as far as best practices, how we, as in the city of New York, are using design, build, and how together we could work to improve our contracts. What's what's missing from their membership? And that's where they're really spearheading the efforts, and then coming back to us and saying, Well, some of our members had some questions about the program and things like that, so that's how we're tying in our local chapter into those conversations. And as Lisa said, it's never an or it's an end, and it's so easy for me as an owner to be working through various organizations and associations obviously always advocating for DBIA and design build done right, rather than with individual firms, because there's a chance I'm going to miss somebody. So we're working with the trade associations, subcontractor associations, I'm meeting with across the board of various industry groups that are meeting in my office to talk about how we can continue to partner in 2025 what are the things that are coming out? How can I help them and their members, as far as workload and staggering projects, as far as bid dates and things like this? So there's so much opportunity in there. And the collaboration, the communication, I will say, has been excellent, and this is something that I'm personally looking forward to in 2025 my

Erin Looney  12:45

new goal is to find a point of disagreement between, you know, for the ratings. Of course, I

Tom Foley  12:51

don't think Lisa is I don't believe I could be wrong Lisa, but I don't think she's a Yankee fan.

12:56

Oh yeah,

Tom Foley  12:59

that's big. Don't think she's a Giants fan. I at this point in this schedule and their current rankings, I don't think I am now either. There are a couple of things there Aaron that Lisa and I don't agree on, but anything with regards to program based communication and collaboration, we're usually very, very much in sync. It's like the Tour de France. We all line up behind Lisa and the peloton, so she leads the way, and it's easier for us, you know, just keep it on our back wheel. There be an

Erin Looney  13:27

amazing year. And I'm going to tag the Yankees and the Giants when we share this so we can make sure they know you are fighting, Lisa, as you've reiterated outside of sports and disagreement and Tom you've illustrated, education is key. So let's talk about this next bucket slash funnel, reinventing learning at DBIA. As we can tell, not just from what we've talked about today, but through a lot of what we do, that education is central to success for our members and for everyone with whom they were, whether we're talking about webinars, continuing education hours, the collaborative, delivery, Leadership Academy, on and on. So why is this focus so critical, and how does it shape the future of DBIA?

Tom Foley  14:11

I firmly believe that the education is the cornerstone of DBIA mission, recognizing the future design build relies on knowledgeable professionals. That's who I want to do business with. By broadening the training programs and increasing the certification opportunities, we're equipping our teams, our designers, our builders, with the skills to innovate and meet the rising demand technology is changing so quickly, and from a design and a contract standpoint, design build helps us get these projects moving along so much faster. And it's key to have everybody that has been trained, the projects obviously move a lot smoother when that happens, when they know the cornerstone as far as what does it mean to be certified? What does it mean for following best practices? So in our world, this is something. That we will continue to advocate for. We're actually starting to put some of these requirements in our RFQs, or requests for qualifications, requests for proposals that the teams will have to be trained, not necessarily certified initially, but within several years, we'll be including that as well. This is just part of best practices. I

Lisa Washington  15:19

agree with Tom, imagine that education is so critical. When I sit and think about our members, I talk to them at conferences, sometimes I think those engaged in the design and construction industry maybe underestimate the importance of what they do. You wouldn't go to a doctor that wasn't appropriately trained, right? What a lawyer that didn't have appropriate training? Why would you not want the people that are building your critical infrastructure to be properly trained and how to collaborate to develop the most sustainable, resilient projects in the most cost effective and timely manner possible? So education is so important, because what this industry does touches everybody, whether it's the roadway, the bridge you're driving over. And look at the number of disasters we've had both man made and natural. You know, whether it's a collapse of a bridge, the Key Bridge, you go back several years and the Pentagon renovation after the planes hit, they're all designed build because our nation needs to rebuild quickly and cost effectively, because it impacts the economy and so many other things. So design build is about so much more than just putting the hammer to nail and building something. It's about triple bottom line success. There's an economic impact, there's a sustainability impact, there's a social impact to what we do at DBIA. And just like doctors and lawyers, you want people that understand how to optimize design, build, delivery, and you can't do that without proper education and training. And the one thing I'll add that we didn't mention about education, yeah, there are webinars, there are courses. The other critical part of education is examples of project success. Tom I tell you, I talk about your first project all the time, your community center that was done 22 months ahead of schedule. You saved billions of dollars. You didn't touch your contingency. That's really important when we have tight budgets and things have to be built quickly. And that couldn't happen without education. Had you not educated your team, none of that would have happened.

Erin Looney  17:30

Now we're going to move on to re imagining membership, which is the fourth bucket, Lisa, you talked about removing barriers to entry a little earlier. There are a few things under membership I want to talk about because there are different groups and different audiences that are going to see some slightly different outcomes and probably have different barriers. So we'll start with the next generation. The strategic plan emphasizes this seamless path from student to young professional membership. What steps will DBIA take to attract and retain those emerging leaders in design build.

Lisa Washington  18:02

I feel that as an organization, we should be reaching these young people as soon as possible, even as early as junior high, but I have to be realistic in what our capabilities are in the coming cycle. So where we're going to focus is that the university and trade school level, what we need to make sure of is that these young professionals that are on the cusp of coming out and joining the industry understand what design build is, why it's important, and that they understand the education and training that's needed. It's interesting. What we're finding is that they likely understand design build better than those seasoned professionals out there, and they wonder why anyone would not collaborate early in a project. So it's a little easier sell than it has been for DBIA in the past, but we talked about our updated curriculum, we're making a concerted effort to reach out to these universities, trade schools and community colleges, so that students can get that curriculum, while their students come out ready to get certified, have a leg up on their career, so that when they go and start interviewing for jobs, they can demonstrate their understanding of collaborative project delivery, specifically designed build, and an understanding that it's growing. So it's going to be a lot of personal outreach, going to involve the regions, because schools are at the grassroots level, and we can only do so much from the national organization, and it's not something we can do with, you know, fancy flyers and email blasts. It's got to be some personal outreach to get champions in these schools, people that will help nurture and grow the next generation of leaders and preparing them to embrace design build as soon as they accept that diploma and cross that stage.

Tom Foley  19:55

That's something that I've seen firsthand. I've recently spoke at. College, my alma mater now called Manhattan University. There's also a student DBIA chapter at Columbia University. And so when I'm engaging with these students, they're not aware of the pitfalls of design bid build. They're not even aware of why we would both design bid build. They weren't aware of what happened 110 years ago during Tammany Hall and things like this, things that have caused us to shift historically from a design build model, which is how the Brooklyn Bridge was built locally, and some of the other amazing bridges, to then transform that into, okay, now you have to design. Now you're going to be designing something for four years. You're gonna have a year of procurement go out to build it for three years, two years of claims that there is an alternate there is an ideal situation, which is design build or progressive design build. It's almost like deer in the headlights when I'm speaking to our young professionals and to students, because they're not sure of why wouldn't we just use this as one of the tools in the toolbox? Totally agree with Lisa, as far as bringing that next generation on, I always have a lot of volunteers. Whenever we're staffing up for a design build project, they're open to all ideas. And as long as we're training them and bringing them up to speed, I think that, you know, it'll be a huge asset to them. And I will say one of the things that became apparent when I was going out into the field and meeting with the project teams and things like this, how design build empowers our staff, because way too long, they were always told what was possible and what's not. As an engineer or an architect working for the city of New York, they were always Oh, how come the projects always take so long? It was almost like this backpack of guilt, of why the bureaucracy weighs them down, and here they're shredding history, they're shredding the backpack, and they're literally taking ownership and what this has meant for them, and I see this so proud for advocating for the tools that they need, and then also empowering themselves. Because they're proving people wrong. It's an amazing motivation of telling people what's possible, what's not that. Yes, we can build an amazing facility that has excellence in design and excellence of sustainability. $100 million building can be designed and constructed in less than 36 months. And I think that's great motivating factor, whether they're in high school, college or in the workplace. I'll do a

Erin Looney  22:18

second quick shout out to the Columbia chapter, because they followed us on LinkedIn, and then they followed me, and then they're always there. They really want to be involved, and it looks really, really great. I love the enthusiasm. Are you interested in sustainable design and construction practices, but concerned about profitability? Us? CAD an Archons company helps forward thinking. ENR, top ranked AEC firms in mitigating risk and driving profit through digitalization, using Autodesk AEC technology to learn more, contact us, cad.com/dbia for a free 30 minute consultation. That's us. Cad.com/dbia on top of the team here at National DBIA has 14 affiliated regions. They're instrumental to design, build success. So what is the role of regions look like going forward, and how is national positioned to help with that

Lisa Washington  23:20

the 14 affiliated regions, they are critical. They are at the grassroots level. Any national organization needs to understand that not everyone is going to be able to attend the National Conference. You know, there are limited travel budgets or limited budgets for online courses. So that local connection at the grassroots level is critical. So I think one of the most important roles that the regions play is they provide a mechanism for members to connect at the local level. Design Build is all about connecting with the right people, the right teams, correct so that's what the regions provide, both at the region end, down one level to the chapters. But we also need to understand that design build in the public sector relies on legislative authority, which is very different from region to region and from state to state. So these regions are very important to keeping their finger on the pulse of what are the opportunities and challenges as it relates to legislative authority. How does our landscape differ in, say, New York for Tom, than it does in California, because the legislative authority is going to drive, to some degree, how the best practices can or can't be implemented, which drives the outcomes. So the regions are very important to helping us assess the landscape across the nation with the limited staff resources that we have, so that they can then build on what national develops as universal best practices to really address those nuances that exist within the regions and the states that they cover, and they provide that connection at that local level. Lisa you. Brought

Tom Foley  25:00

up the West Coast. And I'm just gonna have to pause there for a minute, because I know that they, you know, they have the World Series, the Dodgers obviously beat New York. The Galaxy just beat the Red Bulls. But mark my words, New York City and the tri state area. I know California is well ahead of us in design build, but we're gonna get there in membership. We're gonna get there in training. So I'm really looking forward to, at least in one aspect. Maybe we can catch up with California. We're not going to be doing that with a with a baseball with a soccer ball, but perhaps through our design, build and with your leadership, we're going to get there. I

25:32

just saw a challenge thrown out at Scotland has been hands

Tom Foley  25:36

down. I mean, yeah, without a doubt, absolutely, and if I know it's a podcast, but a visual would be me throwing the mic down so they

Erin Looney  25:44

if it makes you feel any better when it comes to the popularity of our podcast episodes and our blog posts, the California stuff was leading for the year, and then we did that episode with you, Tom and David, and it absolutely blew it out of The water. So you win there.

Tom Foley  26:01

We'll take any victory we can. But I would say in all seriousness that for the local, regions and chapters are key to our success. This is getting the word out, and it's ensuring the consistency and following best practices. It's a means of, as Lisa had stated, not everybody can get out and certainly encourage everybody to work and to collaborate, to Team locally. And this is where local owners provide updates. As far as their programs, we as owners have a responsibility updating and sharing our work plan, and that's where the region and the chapters, that's where it's so important to have those discussions so they know what's coming up. It's very difficult. It's not something that I do of sitting down with individual teams to say what's coming up, but I certainly do that through associations, and so do my peers at the Port Authority economic development the MTA and DBIA in the local chapter, is key to that success. Now

Erin Looney  26:58

a little bit of a shift. This is a move that has already proven really popular. DBIA recently introduced unlimited roster slots for industry partner members talk about the motivation behind that change. That is a really

Lisa Washington  27:12

important change, and I'm very excited about it. That actually may be as exciting as the core curriculum roll out. That could have been my answer to the first question, Aaron, this change is so important not because DBIA, you know, just wants to have a big number of members, but having more critical mass is important to affecting policy change and legislative change. We know that the firms that are members of DBIA, support, design, build. Many have whole units that focus on design build, and we were simply restricting access by having this additional payment structure associated with more people. And again, DBIA is an educational institute. First, the revenue that came in from additional members is really inconsequential compared to the impact we can have if we have more educated members. So by having critical mass, we become a more influential body as we advance design build across the nation, as we try to explain to legislators, how many people are engaged, why it's important, that's what policy makers are looking for right who's behind this movement. So while it also removes that barrier to access that we talked about earlier, that's critically important, it gives more people easier access to our tools and resources. It also helps us expand our reach by having more people and making us a more influential organization when it comes to policy and legislative changes,

Tom Foley  28:43

and that's something that helped us when we were we, as in CDC, with my team and I, advocating in the halls of Albany for progressive design build, for alternate delivery. You know, several years ago, for design build, and it was always for the elected officials. What does your membership look like? How is it set up? So as Lisa indicated, having that membership there, having that core, obviously the regions and the local chapters, but the membership and how that drives and then having others in the room from AIA ACEC, contractor associations, everybody being on the same page, as Lisa had said before, each of those associations are all involved with DBIA, so everybody is nodding their head around the table with the elected officials, so that they know that we're not trying to get something past them. This is common sense. It's not sexy. It doesn't sell, quote, unquote, you know, in the halls of Albany in DC, for that matter. But it's so, so important to have that membership to get the word out, because at the end of the day, it provides more opportunity for everybody. You

Erin Looney  29:45

know, you said it's not sexy, but there is a lid for every pot. There might be someone who's really into this and they're excited to be at that table. I

Tom Foley  29:53

would say, have them give me a call on that, but I'll be happy to talk about design build

Erin Looney  29:58

we're going to switch to if. Spanning under utilized business enterprise engagement, which is also a key part of DBIA goals. So how do we plan to support meaningful growth and provide those opportunities for ubia?

Tom Foley  30:10

This is something that we take very, very seriously in the city of New York, and obviously at my department, what we're seeing across the board on our delivery models, we have standard requirements as far as outreach and within our standard horizontal program, we're at 15% there's opportunities there for our MWB on a design bid build on our design bid build vertical, our goals are at 30% our goals within the design build. The reason that we were able to get the design build legislation was our commitment for the MWBE community and for others small businesses and getting everybody, as I mentioned before, getting others to the table in our design, where our goal is 30% three zero and 30% in construction. And this applies for our obviously $15 billion burbase jails program, which is spearheaded by Eduardo DBIA, and then our design build pilot program being spearheaded by Evie McEvoy. So what we're seeing now in our it's not a surprise to me, but it certainly is throughout the country and in the halls of Albany that our design build program right now is exceeding 38% on each and every project. Our Queens garage at Community Center were over 40% our dismantle contracts where we were using design builds, those were over 48% MWBE, so when I hear another parts of the region, other parts of the country, what's possible, what's not, I love to prove people wrong, and I say this is what we're able to do in New York, and I do not understand why that could not be done elsewhere. We hold our contractors and our designers accountable for meeting these goals. And these aren't just goals in the sense that, Oh, you didn't meet it. Okay. Come back next time. I'll try again. If they do not meet them, if they do not have a plan, they will not be working at DDC or for GDC in the future. This is something that we're extremely serious about. I have to look in the mirror each and every day. And so we're not just coming out and saying this is what you need to do. We're also looking internally. What do we need to do? How can we be a better owner? So we're looking at our payment terms, we're looking at our payment processes, and we're doing everything that we can in order to streamline the process, in order to pay our vendors on time. We're taking those efforts extremely, extremely seriously. We're also adding in items into our contracts, our design build contracts, from mobilization, Value Engineering substitutions, so that way, even when we're past the design phase in construction, or parallel with the design phase in construction and other things become available, or something is delayed from a supply chain management standpoint. Or there's another way of looking at this collaboration. Not just a word, trust is not just a word, it's part of our contract. It's part of our fabric. We're always sitting at the table listening and saying, Okay, how can we improve on our processes? How can we pay our vendors quicker? How can we have registered contingencies so that way our vendors do not have to wait eight months to a year to get paid? And then what does that mean? Imagine you're a small business, and you have to wait a year to get paid. Shame on me. It's not up to the industry to finance my job. That's for the city of New York. That's my job. So I have an amazing team that's always questioning contracts that we've had for more than 20 years. So there's a lot of pilot programs that we're embarking upon. Some have been so successful that being spread around to my colleagues and other agencies, everybody in my office has a quote, unquote permission slip to change things, to question, and not just to pontificate about life, but get some stuff done, and that's what drives us.

Lisa Washington  33:48

And you know, Aaron, I love what Tom is doing in New York, because looking at this from DBIA perspective as a national organization, we're faced with the workforce challenge, right? We hear it all the time. This industry has a challenge with workforce, with design build growing so rapidly, I think that challenge is going to continue, and we're going to need a lot more qualified design build professionals and under utilized business enterprise, whether it's a small, minority owned, women owned, veteran owned, they don't always have to be small, right? Some go on to exceed the qualifications to be considered small, and we need to help foster that kind of growth as an organization to support the growth of design build the most basic way that we are working to support that meaningful growth is to provide ways for ubes to be members that are cost effective for them, understanding that their revenue stream is smaller, and to provide educational opportunities that might be different than the education that's offered to larger firms. So these are just some of the initiatives that you're going to see coming forward for the ubes, because they will be critical to helping us. Solve a workforce challenge that's been with us for many, many years.

Erin Looney  35:03

So now that we have spent a little time with these individual audiences, we're going to go back to 30,000 feet and look down on everyone. Well, look down on them. You know what I mean. We have all these goals and solid plans for getting to these goals, but we couldn't do any of this without our committees. We've got several committees at DBIA. They're vital to our success. Let's look at the evolution over the last year, and then talk a bit about how they're going to be key in meeting the new strategic goals. What I love about DBIA

Lisa Washington  35:32

is that we're nimble and we're flexible. Many membership organizations have a committee structure, and that's the committee structure at DBIA, we are very deliberate in looking at our committee structure every three years to make sure that it aligns with our strategic goals, that committees have distinct priorities that are in support of strategic goals that are outlined by the board of directors. And so the evolution is constant at DBIA, because we're continually assessing those committees their goals and how it aligns with our strategic direction. But the most fundamental aspect of committees and why they're so vital, is that committees help divide work into manageable chunks. We have a lot of goals, a lot of things we want to achieve at the organization. So with our diverse membership, our committees can also be very diverse. So just like we bring in diverse perspectives for our tools and resources and in our strategic planning, when the committee sits down to manage these chunks of information and the chunks of work that they're assigned to take on, they also bring in diverse perspectives, and by aligning their work with that of the strategic goals, it just makes for a very seamless process. And our committee members are committed. They are passionate about design, build, and I think Tom agrees, much of what we did in the last three years would not have been possible without committees between 2022 and 2024 they developed over 30 new tools and resources. We anticipate equally as many coming out in the 25 through 27 planning cycle, by making sure that there's constant communication with the board and that they have clear direction that we continually assess whether or not what they're doing is supporting the strategic direction.

Erin Looney  37:19

Now you're just assuming Tom will agree, and I

Tom Foley  37:22

do, and the committees are really what makes it possible. And as Lisa had pointed out, very agile, they will adjust. Right? It's a different world now than it was certainly four years ago, to have the committees, I will say, is, really is the backbone of DBIA.

Erin Looney  37:36

So this is now our wild speculation part of the show. It's actually not that wild. In 2023 FMI released some market research that showed design build was expected to account for 47% of construction spending, 22.5% growth in total design build spending by 2026 which does not it seems further off than it is, but it's like next year. Now, new research just came out last month, and we are going to have an episode entirely dedicated to the ins and outs of that new research. But let's look at the big picture. What does that new research say, and how do you expect that data to influence DBIA focus in 2025 that research

Lisa Washington  38:16

says a lot. That research says number one, design build is continuing to grow. And I love historical data. If you look back to 2005 design bid build was 70% of construction spending, and now design bid build is like just over 10% of spending. So I often like to say that while the design build growth is impressive. What's more important is the decline in design bid build, which says that the industry has moved to collaborative delivery, and design build is at the top of the list of collaborative methods. So I think that's one thing that the research tells us, but the research also tells us is there going to be a lot of new owners entering the market for design build, and that means that they're going to be more people that need training, or owners that might need the assistance of owner advisors to help guide the way for them. Research tells us that those owner advisors need to be well versed in the distinct characteristics of design build, because being an owner advisor in a more adversarial design bid build environment doesn't make you well suited to be an advisor in a design build environment. So buyer beware when you're hiring these advisors. Lots of data, numbers and facts into research. But I think overall, big picture, what it tells us is we're going to have a lot of demand for design build, and it could be a lot of design build done wrong if we are not diligent in expanding our reach, getting the education out there and really helping industry understand the core components of design build done right because we want to continue to affect positive legislative change, we have to continue to show. The success of design build and just one owner that does a big project that thinks that just signing a single source contract is all they need to do. Could set design build back years, because it will get the attention of those nobody wants to hear about when it went well. Everybody wants to talk about when it goes wrong. So design build done right is critical, and that's what the research tells us. Totally

Tom Foley  40:24

agree. Lisa, it all comes down to education, certification, making sure that owners are aware of the best practices. Not only that they're aware, but they're implementing it, and that is going to ensure the continued growth. Being able to pivot is so critical in design, build, and especially as an owner, if we're seeing something that we could do better to be able to make that change, to say yes, you know, I made a mistake. I know owners don't like to say that. I certainly know elected officials don't like to say that. I say it every day. Okay, I screwed up. How can we improve this? Because so important to lead by example. And as Lisa said, if everybody has to be on the same page with as far as the education and the credential and experiences, the owners reps and owner advisor, because there is, there's so much work that's out there now, and so much more that's coming.

Erin Looney  41:14

So I want to close this not with a question, but with an observation. Working at DBIA and Lisa, I'm not just saying this because I'm talking to you. Has been a highlight of my long, slightly illustrious career, largely because of the incredible people. This includes our leadership, our staff, board members, instructors, membership people who come to one of our events for the very first time, no matter what the situation, DBIA has supported this positive experience every time I seen us interact with anyone, even if there's disagreement, and believe it or not, there is disagreement here and there. And I really believe there's a connection between the nature of design build itself and the types of people DBIA attracts and the types of people this work attracts, and having both of you at the helm just means more of that positive engagement and more of that commitment to helping us reach those strategic goals for the betterment of the industry. I

Lisa Washington  42:07

think Aaron could have done the podcast. Tom I agree.

Tom Foley  42:12

It's an amazing group that is committed to improving processes, improving projects right at the end of the day, that improves the community in which we serve, and it changes the fabric of the country. And it does so obviously, in a meaningful way. DBIA and leases leadership, it has a profound impact on how we're able to lease in my world, and I know that speak of others on the West Coast, down south and in the middle of the country, but this just leads the way, and it's so so important and so impactful. If

Erin Looney  42:40

2025 is anything like 2024 we are in for more big ideas, bold moves, and probably a lot more of Tom and Lisa agreeing on just about everything. I'm gonna make it my resolution to get them to disagree on something other than sports, and I promise when I finally do, I will share it with you. Now, since I agreed no more dad jokes, here's another fun fact, January is named after Janus, the Roman god of beginnings and transitions. He's often depicted with two faces, one looking to the past and one to the future. That's kind of a fitting reminder for the growth of design build, how we looked at where we were and where we've been, some lessons learned, and how those lessons shape the innovation of tomorrow. And just a reminder, you can now text the show at the link located at the top of every episode description on Apple podcasts, Buzzsprout, Spotify and Google podcast I'd love to hear from you. Just try to be somewhat civilized. Okay, look, I can't do it. You're still getting at least a few dreadful jokes, but I'm going to try this year to at least keep them industry theme. So why did the architects celebrate New Year's Eve at their drafting table? Because they wanted to start the year off on the right scale. A big thanks to Lisa Washington and Tom Foley for sharing their insights today. Fred Yi for his editing skills, you for starting me here with us, and, of course, us, CAD and our cons company for making the design build delivers podcast possible. Learn more at us, cad